Looking for a boat

[Tim Noyce]

Hi Max,

In 2005 there was a rule change which allowed for larger sails (12.5 upwind sail area was increased to 15.5 and the spinnaker was increased from 15 to 21) and the use of a second trapeze was also brought in. Theoretically, all you would need to do to 2654 would be to put bigger sails on it and attach a second trapeze. This might sound easy but you would probably need to extend the mast, boom and spinnaker pole to fit it all in and it wouldn't be a very balanced set up.

In my view, your best bet would be to buy the boat and sail it as it is currently. It will give you a very good idea of what Cherub sailing is all about, you will be able to come to events and sail against boats of a similar age with the same size sails as there is a good 97 rules racing scene currently. Once you have got the hang of it and saved up some pennies, you would then be in a great position to buy a newer 2005 rules boat a bit later down the line.

Speak to Torchy nicely and he might let you take Loco out for a spin, or failing that try and come along to the next event and someone will certainly be able to take you for a sail after racing is over.

Cheers,

Tim

[Max McCarthy]

Hi Tim,

Firstly, thanks for the help, so it seems that it would be a better idea to get a '97 rules cherub instead of anything else at the moment,

Thanks again,

Max

[ade white]

Hi Max, i have owned and sailed many different classes over 40 years of sailing and recently got a cherub, an older wooden one, Kokopelli on 91 rules, and we now have a 97 rules as well, Sweet Dreamzzz.
...Got to say the best boat and 'buzz for bucks' you can buy. Nothing touches the grin factor you will get as you fly the kite first time, awesome! The boats can be 'crafted in many ways with little building experience and there is always many willing cherubists to help with any problems. Hope to see you soon. Maybe Rutland  22nd Sept if all well.

[Will_Lee]

In my view, your best bet would be to buy the boat and sail it as it is currently. It will give you a very good idea of what Cherub sailing is all about, you will be able to come to events and sail against boats of a similar age with the same size sails as there is a good 97 rules racing scene currently. Once you have got the hang of it and saved up some pennies, you would then be in a great position to buy a newer 2005 rules boat a bit later down the line.

This is the same advice I give everyone. It is widely disregarded (which is ok), but you will have more fun if you go 97 rules first. Flat Stanley (35 years old I think) can still deliver.

[roland_trim]

+1 to both Will and Tims comments.

I put a serious ammount on tension on Norfolk when she was with me two months ago. No bangs or pops and no opening cracks. Hayley would have kept her for playing in at Chew if did not already have Born Slippy for that.

Talk nicely to Martin  - you are on his driving route between homes...

[Stuberry]

I love this picture of Cheese!

[roland_trim]

I love this picture of Cheese!

Trying to find a reply without the words "so young" or "when John was cute".

Were John and Digby are a skinny 15 in this shot?

[Stuberry]

It was only January last year!! So I guess they were 16.

"Kids grow up so fast" etc. etc.

But still... "Bless"

[Max McCarthy]

Thanks everyone for your help. We are now seriously thinking about getting 2654.

Thanks again,

Max

Edit: that is one nice picture of cheese, what a great looking boat!

[Torchy]

Yes, at Bartley, if racing we'll single wire.

'05 rules didn't change the hull measurements but allowed twin wiring and bigger sails (12.5sqm -> 15.5sqm and 15sqm (kite) -> 21sqm)

The hulls then developed (because of twin wiring) and bars (racks) replaced wings. Having said that the basic hull shape hasn't changed massively eg Born Slippy (still '97 Rules) and Atum Bom ('05 Rules) are both 'Slugs' but look totally different...except the hulls are the same shape.

Early 1990s boats (correct me guys if I get this wrong) pre-date a 'Rise of floor' measurement rule change and are therefore somewhat different.

Several boats have had successful 'conversions' to '05 Rules eg Cheese Before Bedtime by removal of wings and addition of racks. Loco has wings and is of a shape which prevents conversion to racks but underneath the hull is very narrow and the significant variation from modern hulls (and many Cherub hulls) is because she has more rocker....though much of it is in the bow sections and perhaps less of an issue with maximum top speed than some think. She is very fast in light conditions. It is said tho' that the big advantage of modern designs is that they go through waves downwind. Here's Graham at the Nationals: http://greensea.zenfolio.com/p998604808/h4029554c#h4029554c (he actually did come out the other side)

The other real issue with conversions is mast position. In the later boats masts have moved back close to the centre of the boat, the jib has got bigger (the main proportionately smaller) and the bowsprit longer (much longer). Have a look at Evo - any boat after SN 3,000 will do tho' http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/boats/3213

NB In Cherubs the Aussies got SN between 2701 and 3000, so there has been a jump from 'Dan's Boat' to 'Banshee Ambulance'

There are 4 modern designs: Ellways 5,6 (The 6 is the Arup Skiff), Biecker1 (Ronin) and the Banshee. The Cherub Daemon is 'just' a Slug development but came 2nd this year at Nationals!

[Torchy]

PS I'm hearing rumours that price is negotiable on Cheese. We nearly bought Cheese when we bought Loco. John has smaller sails which would enable Cheese to go '97 Rules at Bartley but still be '05 on bigger water.

Having said that a good '97 rules boat is a good way in and they get snapped up very quickly.

[Torchy]

I love this picture of Cheese!

That is an awesome photo

[Max McCarthy]

Thanks Torchy, as you said it seems to be that a '97 rules boat is the way to go for us anyway.

Does anyone know anything about the trifle design, (what 2654 is) i.e. any good or bad points about it.

Many thanks,

Max

[Torchy]

All I know is that people go misty-eyed when you mention the Trifle. That would be the Flying Trifle (see boat page)....(gazes off into the distance and falls into silence............)

[Tim Noyce]

The Trifle is a pretty moderate design but has known to be quite exciting downwind. Would be a great first boat though as it will give you a proper taste of what Cherub sailing is all about.