ISAF helpfully building a consensus....

[Will_Lee]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/27/sports/othersports/27sailing.html?_r=1&ref=othersports

[ben_brown]

I'd be interested on what people think. Are kites sail powered craft or not?

Even as a windsurfer that considers 'kiters' to have a questionable sexuality and a fondness for tea trays, I reckon they should count. Assuming they are actually sailing on something deep enough to be water and not a big puddle.

Seems like a bit of sour grapes to me..

[dave_ching]

Anyone that will do over 50Knts on a T Trey deserves the record.
It would be interesting to deiscover what they think Kiteboarding is if it isn't sailing.
Yet again rules are used to destroy what they were set up to create.
Strange they really think they are doing the rite thing.
All I ever thought of doing with a T trey was sliding down a snowy hill.
Kids today huh!

[Will_Lee]

Yes - This is just fear of the new.

http://buntsblog.blogspot.com/2008/11/big-controversy-as-50-knot-kite-record.html,

That said, what if I was to claim the record like this:

1) Get in a hot air or gas balloon.
2) Wait until the wind gets up to 50 knots.
3) Zoom past WPNSA trailing a length of cotton in the water from the balloon.

Is that a sailing craft? I'd say no because there is no aerodynamics going on - it's just drag and buoyancy.

As for a kiteboard, how could it be anything other than a sailing craft?

(Also WSSRC took the money to go and measure the speed in Namibia. Surely they would not do that if it wasn't a sailing craft?)

[dave_ching]

True but the difference comes from the Person,
Attached in some way to a solid object which is attached to the water for the majority of its journey.
And what is to say we are not just really inefficent kiteboarders.
It is just a matter of how we fly our kites/sails. We use carbon sticks they use light weight ropes.
They are both ways of creating motion from a pressure difference.
See, rules can be fun as long as the net result of those rules is to think wow thats cool can i have a go.

[dave_ching]

Also isnt your return trip counted for a record.
That may take a little longer in a balloon.

[Ben Howett]

Even as a windsurfer that considers 'kiters' to have a questionable sexuality and a fondness for tea trays, I reckon they should count. Assuming they are actually sailing on something deep enough to be water and not a big puddle.

As a kiter who considers polesurfers to have... never mind.

Kitesurfing as sailing feels a little wrong somehow but really theres no reason it should be classed any differently to windsurfing and while Il hapily watch sit and watch them down on the beach the wind-whacking at the olympics was embarasing. Perhaps neither should be 'sailing'?

Then again.. both carry people over the water using only the force of the wind, Both can travel upwind and downwind at reasonable VMGs and can make their way around a racecourse...

[simon_jones]

Will , when you decide the time is right to get in your hot air balloon in a plus fifty knot wind, make sure you wear a bouyancy aid. SAFETY FIRST ! 

[daryl_wilkinson]

This pretty much sums up 'sailing' for me. I love 'sailing'. But I hate 'sailing' and the entwined nature of the sport and the court / committee room. It's all a rich mans power trip. Some of the craft out there trying to beat this speed barrier are just as unconventional as a kiteboard, maybe if this French guy had got sponsored by 'Oracle' they wouldn't of had a problem.

Sorry, Sunday morning with a cold and grumpy.

[dave_ching]

No its getting old I'm like that more and more.
Very true though.

[Phil Alderson]

Its all a bit boring, I bet they made the same fuss when the windsurfers first went faster than the boats, and probably when the first solid sails were used.

[phil_kirk]

or even when they took the keels off small boats and people started hiking. When you think of it that makes an SB3 a bit dated.

Each case is a step in evolution to meet the aim. Sailing as we know it is one way of meeting the aim. Kites are a way of harnessing the power of the wind without the weight of the mast, boom and the need to have a structure to take all the rig loads. Quite clever really.

I could try and describe it as: being propelled by the wind through the air/water interface.

Does sail rocket's air rudder make it any les of a boat?

I doubt the speed sailing rules require the craft to float or support the weight of it's pilot.

That's my thoughts anyway.

[daryl_wilkinson]

they have ratified the kite record today!

[Will_Lee]

The Kite record thing is great news!

I have a strong memory of the WSSRC rules saying that the craft has to be able to start from being stopped on the water, which essentially means it must be buoyant, but checking it on the web it seems to just insist that the sailors must be buoyant, with no mention of the craft!

[daryl_wilkinson]

Especially as when you think about it 'Speedrocket' is doing the same thing as a kite surfer, just using a solid wing and solid kite lines and a longer board!