New kit

[roland_trim]

Looks like Jamie is finding his bearings...

Whats new in your life?

[RobinJones]

Well, since she was last at an event, Banshee has had extensive work carried out, with stump/compression bars added, along with fixing her gantry - she has been pretty solid recently, holds rig tension and has been out in some very windy conditions, so with a bit of luck she might be okay for a while.

But as well as that, I've a new centerboard in the process of being shaped (obeche, western red cedar, and a central pine stringer, soon to be carbon sheathed), since I've been using a bit of a lash up board for the past few months just to stay sailing. I've also acquired a carbon wing mast that i'm going to have a bit of a play with, but I shouldn't think that will see any events, at least this year - more just something to keep myself occupied 

So yeah, its been fairly busy over winter at Banshee HQ...

[JP233]

Still working on my worm screw stock. Got those spherical bearings for the bottom gudgen to reduce play.
Need to copy robins kite halyard tube thing at some point.

Oh. And my battens are falling off my job. Needs to bring more tape to Rutland

[pratn0]

Oh. And my battens are falling off my job. Needs to bring more tape to Rutland

i have some heavy duty double sided tape and sticky back. so we will sort it properly so not a bodge job.

[Clive Everest]

I think that you could be onto something with the wing rig Robin.
I used to sail A cats. Their rigs are fantastic.
I contemplated it when we were building A+E but decided that we already had enough on.
I was also concerned about making it flip reliably during tacks and gybes.
It is not an issue on A cats as they have no kicker and the leach tension is released.
Nicky and Julian Bethwaite won the Cherub worlds in 72 with a wing rig.

Good luck.

[RobinJones]

Thanks Clive!

I'm very concerned about getting it to pop properly during tacks, though I believe I may have come up with one or two solutions. Both use a slider along the boom, and a sort of pushrod system attached to the mast spanner. The first system would use the trapeze elastic to pull the slider forwards, and hence push the spanner to rotate the mast. The elastic would be set up so that with no crew on the trapeze, the elastic has negligible tension, and the mast can pop. Then when the crew heads onto the new wire, it would apply a rotational force again.

The alternative system would be based on using the outhaul itself to actuate the same spanner, meaning when the sail was full, it would apply a turning force on the mast using the same slider/pushrod/spanner system. the danger here is the sail filling before the mast pops, and the mast locking to windward.

Of course its possible the kicker will not allow it to work. But hey, i like experimenting with boats. It'll take a long time to get it sorted even in a best case scenario, so really, I'm just going to see how it goes!

Do you know if you'll be at Rutland? It would be great to have a chat regarding wing masts/your experiences with A's!

[Clive Everest]

Hi Robin,
A pull on the spanner from the trapeeze sounds like it could work. A manual line to pop it round in lighter conditions would also help.
Unfortunately I will not be at Rutland but I hope to get the fittings back on the boat this weekend.

I also had over rotating masts on my moths, Probably before you were born. They came about after I put a goose neck on very pissed and found I was a knot faster on Starboard.
If you fit it and try it you will know more than the rest of us.
I had manual lines to pop it if it did not go by it self. The effect of popping the mast was a bit like popping battens. Suddenly the rig really worked.

Email me direct if you want.

Have fun at Rutland.

Clive.

[JimC]

I was also concerned about making it flip reliably during tacks and gybes.

Most of the time I just grabbed the handle as I went through the boat mid tack - pulled myself thro faster and tacked the mast at the same time. Failing that just pushed it across with a boot. Never really found it a very big deal once I was in the habit.
Nowadays I think I'd start with having the gooseneck on a mast stump so kicker loads weren't fighting the mast rotation. I did try that back in the mid 80s but an alloy mast stump comprehensively and spectacularly failed, even supported by lowers.

[Tim Noyce]

I agree with Jim. I'd be stumping to gooseneck height and then having the wing above that.  Could well save you a fair bit of weight too removing that amount of mast!

[JimC]

I agree with Jim. I'd be stumping to gooseneck height and then having the wing above that.  Could well save you a fair bit of weight too removing that amount of mast!

On the other hand, thinking aloud, if Frank Bethwaite was right about how great the aerodynamic advantages of the 9er style mast cuff are, then a wing mast to deck level coupled with a mast cuff ought to be a fairly useful aerodynamic package.
I did try a mast cuff on my Canoe, but I found that not being able to see exactly where the jib clew was for tuning the jib sheeting really psyched me out, so I abandoned it!

[RobinJones]

Right, so just thought I'd put a little post up about the wing

Its went up for the first time last night. A number of small teething problems, but in general very happy with it. Main issue is that the spanner fouls the boom at the moment, but that's just a minor problem.

Obviously the sail doesn't suit the mast at all - the bottom half actually looks alright, but where the luff curve is (sort of centred around a point 1/3 of the way from the tip) the sail is far far too deep. A combination of lots of cunno and a lack of batten tension on battens 1 and 2 gave something that looked sailable.

I want to minimise the number of times I recut the luff, hence sailing it first and noting what I think needs to be done, along with pulling as much bend into the mast as i can, and measuring it/cutting the luff of the sail to these measurements.

The spreaders are in a very odd position, quite high up on the rig - however there is some reasoning. The spreaders are actually swinging - hence the mast sort of rotates inside of them, the spreader tips staying in nearly the same position regardless of mast rotation. This allows me to run mast head caps (since I'm scared of snapping the mast with the kite), and helps pull the tip of the mast to windward to a greater extent the more the mast is rotated. This is due to the difference in the fore/aft position of the diamond anchor points and the spreaders pivot position. It also means that as the mast is rotated less, to depower, I lose progressively more windward bend, and gain slightly more backwards bend owing to the higher tension on the leeward diamond.

The mast tacks surprisingly well, though i have a trapeze line actuated elastic system to force the mast as far round as the limiter (adjustable) will allow it.

With a bit of luck, Banshee will be out both days this weekend sailing with this setup.

[JayW]

Sounds fun - any pics please?