Ronin - winter refit

[Clive Everest]

Thanks for all the comments.
Lots to ponder.  The auto release on the halyard sounds very good.

What are you coating the kites with?
Clearly a newer kite would be easier, but we do not want to trash a new one whilst learning.

We had a brief test sail in Atum at the bonfire blast.  One of the things that we noted was how much better the jib worked compared with the Knife.

I like the idea of mounting the cleat on a wedge or an angled turret so that the angle drops if led further back.

The forecast for this weekend does not look good for a second outing, and unfortunately this may be our last opportunity before the spring - plenty of time to get it all working.

Clive

[Will_Lee]

Clive - I've been thinking about an echo sounder for a while. Transponder built into the tip of a spare board is what I was thinking of, with a wired display (or homebrew one with a howler), but that looks v cheap and easy to fit to the transom.

Also - jib turrets: Yes I agree that one which slopes backward to maximise the proximity of the 'control cone' of the jib sheet with the racks is what is required.

Something I saw years and years ago (1992) at Halfway YC on some of the Contenders there was a special kind of 'ratchet' which gripped the rope tight like a circular clam cleat (a bit like the top of a self tailer winch). When you pull in and release it would lock and then you pull in again and release and it would spin backwards to ease. It worked this way alternately, like a bathroom pull chord light switch. One of these would be useable from anywhere and ergonomically acceptable too. No-one I have spoken to remembers these except me. I think they could really help the jib cleat issue.

Atum's jib system was the product of tinkering on Norwegian Blue and Aqua Marina. It is 2:1 only so loads of rope isn't required, and the 2:1 is between the track and the clew so a straighter track can be used without it centreing. We used a 49er track so we could stand on it without issue. To improve Subtle's (which I think still has  4:1 jib sheet) you could start by changing it to a 2:1 with the purchase on the clew. This also means the sheet does not block out in either direction.

Kites are coated with Holmenkol usually. Is expensive but really works. We bought a new kite for the 2007 nationals and treated the old one with Holmenkol. After that we had trouble telling them apart.


 

[PaulJ]

Latest progress on Ronin, not a sharp corner in sight, chute has 2 layers of kevlar in the high wear areas plus the carbon. Raised bit is 70mm above the deck, photos make it look much bigger though, still on course for the epoxy primer by the end of the week

[Clive Everest]

Hi Will,
I am old enough to remember the cleating ratchets you describe.  I believe that the issue with them was that you could not easily tell if they were on or off.  They may well work on the jib.
We have a tapered mainsheet.  The taper has a similar action in the ratchet block.  It will be going very soon

Interesting your comments on the jib purchase.  We seemed to have a lot of sheet.

For the spinnaker coating do you mean this:
hxxp: www. ldcsailing. com/holmenkol-textile-wash. ir?cName=clothing-clothing-by-type-clothing-protectionrepair&src=froogle
How do you apply it, I assume that you do not put the kite in the wash.

or this:
hxxp: www. amazon. co. uk/Holmenkol-Natural-Snowboard-Spray-200ml/dp/B004AZ95C0

Clive

[Tim Noyce]

I think that the 4:1 lasted a whole one sail before I was so annoyed by the masses of sheet that it just had to go!

With the homenkol you put it in a bucket and simply dunk the kite in there till its had a good coating. You should be able to do more than one kite per hit.

[andy_peters]

Ease of kite was one of the main concerns Jill had about a cherub, her experience standing in for my absent 4000 crew when we were first married (Jill and I, not my 4000 crew and me - that would have been most unpleasant) was not good.   Funnily enough we have the same one rope system as the 4000 but with bigger turning blocks and everyting lined up so there is minimal friction on the rope.  We also have a very large entry into the spinny chute with quite a high metal loop, also the chute iteslf is very baggy so it doesn't constrict the kite.  We have a three patch kite.  We have a plastic ring on a line on the bottom patch and a knot and bobble between the 2nd and top patch to keep them all apart.  I believe it all works well (and I would get to know sharpish if it didn't)  still doesn't stop me 'encouraging' Jill on drops and hoists tho 

As the the jib sheet, ours is like Will described.  2:1 on a 49er track through a turning block at the starboard end, through a ratchet block on the deck under the wing bar and up to an angled clam cleat on a jib turret which is about 10cm high.  Both Jill or I can adjust the jib from the rack either side.  We do have to ease the jib each tack and pull it back on afterwards partly due to the radius of the track and partly to keep the sails vertical.

[Will_Lee]

Hi Clive,

I am so glad you remember those blocks. They were a bit big. Just to work out how it would work I made a CAD model of one a while ago. It's an interesting problem to make a thing a lot like a clock escapement. The more I think about it,, the keener I am on this idea again. The special block would not need to be on the cockpit floor. It could be anywhere in the system, even the jib clew (if small). It will have a minimum resolution which might interfere with subtle jib adjustments.

We put the holmenkol on with a sponge with the spi laid out on the ground.

Best wishes,

Will

[Clive Everest]

Hi Will,
It is possible that the blocks were made / branded by Elvstrom and imported by Rondar.

Given that the jib sheet has a straight run a linear toggle cleat system could be introduced rather than a rotary system.  This could be made by adapting a standard cleat, with inspiration from a Bic Ballpoint,  or by scaling the mechanism from a roller / Venetian blind cleat.

The mechanism in an inertial reel seat belt may also be usable.

I would worry that if you pull the jib in as hard as you can you will not then be able to pull it a bit harder to release it.

I am going to try a Spinlock PRX cleat on a suitable swivel.


Holmenkol appear to make a huge range of products.
hxxp: www. holmenkol. com/en. html
Do you know which you used. ?


Clive

[phil_kirk]

Holmenkol seal and glide is what you want.  Costs about £35 but will do 1.5  05 rules kites.  The pack includes 2 bottles. 

We have the same 49er track that Will suggested and the 2:1 between the clew and the track.  This is done without the shet going forward before coming back to the track leaving the foredeck clear but does mean that sheet needs to run through the block on the clew and the 2 blocks on the track car during each tack.  This is similar to how a yacht may rig the main sheet through the traveller car if using a maisheet winch on either side of the cockpit.  The 49er track radius is not quite perfect and like Andy and Jill we have to ease a little sheet out before each tack. The Car on the 49er track uses wheels rather than ball bearings which means the leach tension may increase friction during a tack.  A Burr free track with a ball bearing car may present less friction.  If you run the sheet forward from the car to the fore deck the position on the foredeck needs to quite far forward and spot on the centreline to maintain the same tension on each side of the track.

[Clive Everest]

Thanks Phil,
Unfortunately I cannot find a distributor with stock.

Additionally there are recent posts on kite surfing forums suggesting that it has been discontinued.

I will keep searching.

Clive.

[Stuberry]

I think Pete B sells Holmenkol products.

[Tim Noyce]

I think that any waterproofing product is likely to give roughly the same effect. Tent / clothing waterproofing should give good results.

[Phil Alderson]

I have used fabsil tent waterproofing on a few kites and it is quite effective. I am curently working my way through a huge bottle of nikwax tent waterproofer and it is not as good as the fabsil but is less smelly.

[PaulJ]

Things are moving along well in Weymouth, still on target for epoxy primer at the end of the week

Cracks in the kickbars have been laminated
Mast step plate has been made, ready to be fitted today
Kingposts under the foredeck have been repaired and reinforced with the addition of small guides for the spinnaker pole
Chute partly faired, hopefully be finished today

No photos today, but hopefully I will get some tomorrow

[PaulJ]

Ronin has been in the paint booth over the weekend, first coat of epoxy primer applied, more sanding to follow then first topcoat sometime next week