UK-Cherub Forum
Cherub Chat => Tech Chat => Topic started by: JimC on September 22, 2016, 07:43:14 PM
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Anyone know of UK suppliers other than Bainbridge? And preferably in longer lengths? I need to glue a track on a Moth spar. C-tech get their track in 3m lengths which would be perfect for me, but separate carriage is impossible, and the only mast they have going to the UK in the near future is for Yorkshire, so doesn't help much with getting a couple of bits to Surrey. Theoretically I think its caravan awning track, but all the UK suppliers seem only to do aluminium.
Jim C
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Im reliably informed that the plastic mast track on Madge was from Bank and was in a single 6m(or abit bigger) section.
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banks sails not batt
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Thanks, makes sense. Banks are a Bainbridge distributor.
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Also Hartleys have C-teck plastic track for the Byte C11. You would have to join sections if using this... Soon there should be full lengths available - re the Contender.
My new mast from Selden has a carbon track, but that could probably be a special order and take time.
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Thanks. I think I'm going to get some from C-tech bunged in with someone else's new mast!
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Ade do they also do the sail feeders for the plastic track?
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Ovington - 49er mast track (what we have on Usagi) or selden do a slightly heavier musto skiff/RS800 mast track.
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I am going to fit a new luff track to Loco's C-Tech mast.
I was thinking of using a 49er track or the Selden track and some RS masts - and bonding it on with an acrylic, either Plexus MA310 or Araldite 2021.
Sound like a good plan?
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Yes this is what lots of people have done.
Other option is structural adhesive such as: http://www.easycomposites.co.uk/#!/resin-gel-silicone-adhesive/structural-adhesives/vm100-black-methyl-methacrylate-adhesive.html (http://www.easycomposites.co.uk/#!/resin-gel-silicone-adhesive/structural-adhesives/vm100-black-methyl-methacrylate-adhesive.html) however i have found on some uses when it lets go, the whole cured part comes off in a single piece leaving no residue. Not certain on its value in this use case.
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Yes this is what lots of people have done.
Other option is structural adhesive such as: http://www.easycomposites.co.uk/#!/resin-gel-silicone-adhesive/structural-adhesives/vm100-black-methyl-methacrylate-adhesive.html (http://www.easycomposites.co.uk/#!/resin-gel-silicone-adhesive/structural-adhesives/vm100-black-methyl-methacrylate-adhesive.html) however i have found on some uses when it lets go, the whole cured part comes off in a single piece leaving no residue. Not certain on its value in this use case.
I've had this issue but it was mainly due to the area not being keyed up enough once that was redone it has been solid. (currently holds my spreaders and gooseneck on.
Nick
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As Nick has said, as long as you follow a few simple rules then you should be fine as these modern adhesives are very good indeed. Firstly make sure the area is nice and smooth (by removing any loose laquer/paint/dirt), secondly you need to key it in well to give your adhesive something to bite into (worth doing both parts... track and mast), thirdly you need to ensure that both parts are clean and free from grease before you get sticky (use some rubbing alcohol or something that isn't going to leave a residue).
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C-Tech tell me they currently use Adhesive Technologies HPR25, which is an NZ product, a rubber toughened epoxy.
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So, I have the track, time to glue it on. The recommended options seem to be Plexus MA420 or SPAbond 345. All well and good, but both are two parts with a special "gun" to apply, which is hideously expensive to buy for a job I hope never to do again. Is there anyone in easy reach of Surrey who would be prepared to lend me the implement for one or the other?
Jim C
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Hi Jim,
I have 50mL and 200 / 400mL guns in Southampton.
Clive
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Plexus can be hand mixed. We use a tiller extension of cut to push out equal dollups
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I am working on a refresh of my mast, and am replacing the whole track. I have not used either of the adhesives suggested below. Do they cure hard, or to a rubber finish? Also how much do you think you would need for a 5.5m length?
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Hi Phil.
I hope that this means that you will be sailing soon.
Will we see you at Stone?
I use Devweld 530 / 531.
530 cures even faster.
http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/acrylic-adhesives/2368134/?searchTerm=devweld+531&relevancy-data=636F3D3126696E3D4931384E4C446573635461786F6E6F6D794272616E645365617263685465726D325F74656D70266C753D656E266D6D3D6D617463687061727469616C6D617826706D3D5E5B5C707B4C7D5C707B4E647D3F5C707B5A737D2D2C2F255C2E5D2B2426706F3D31313326736E3D592673743D4B4559574F52445F4D554C54495F414C5048415F414E445F4D554C54495F414C5048415F4E554D455249432673633D592677633D4E4F4E45267573743D64657677656C6420353331267374613D64657677656C642035333126
They are very similar to Plexus.
It is worth getting the applicator and mixing nozzles. The glue goes off fast and these make mixing and applying much for accurate and cleaner.
How good is the fit of the track to the mast?
50mL will give a 3.5mm bead over a 5.5m length.
If the track is 1cm wide this will give a glue line 1mm thick which should be enough if the fit is good.
I would have a second tube available when you start in case you apply too much initially.
They do cure hard but not the glass like finish of properly cured epoxy. More the hardness of PVC or ABS.
Clive.
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Hi Clive,
We have been sailing a bit, but it is hard for us to get away for a week with a wee one.
I was thinking that the applicator was going to be very useful, just being able to put a neat bead down the track with the applicator/mixer would make the job much eisier.
The track looks an OK fit at the bottom, but where the mast has tapered, there is more of a gap around the edges.
I will have a look at the Devweld.
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Hi Phil,
The plexus comes in the same standard 50mL cartridges and uses the same applicator and mixing nozzles.
I understand regarding the wee one.
If you are very lucky you then get a few brief years where it is cool to sail with dad.
Clive