UK-Cherub Forum
Cherub Chat => Introduction to Cherubs => Topic started by: BenR on August 20, 2011, 09:49:19 PM
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Hi All,
I am new to the Forum, and hope to be new to the class soon. I am looking to step up significantly from my Laser 2 and thought that a Cherub seemed like the way to go. I turned up to Lee on Solent this morning and spoke to a couple of you (thanks for the help btw). You have all but convinced me that Cherubs are the way to go and I am looking towards buying my first boat.
My only real concern about sailing a cherub is that I am not the lightest of chaps and together with my potential crews (my brother or sister) we could be anywhere between 23 and 26 stone. From what I have read on the class website, this is about the upper limit.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Ben
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Hi Ben, welcome to the forum and I hope to the class. At 90kilos myself I will happily talk you through your options, get me on the contacts page ...
http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/whototalkto (http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/whototalkto)
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Welcome to the class Ben. He is now the proud owner of Atum Bom
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Welcome indeed Ben. She's a fantastic boat.
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Welcome Ben, if you want to meet your fellow Cherubers then a good number will be at Queen Mary at the start of October. No better way to get your feet wet (and probably the rest of you). There will be at least one other pairing of new boat and crew there so plenty of help and advice available.
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So you listened to our advice.
Fortunately it was one of those rare ocations my advice was worth listening to.
We are in Poole so if you want any help just ask.
It will be a good idea to come to the inlands.
You will learn more in one weekend than in months on your own.
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I can only agree with the previous comments, welcome to the class and please do come along to the Inlands, it is allways useful to see what others are doing. And you have bought a great boat.
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Thanks all,
Absolutely thrilled with the boat.
Had a bit of a gusty first sail in her with Paul and despite spending the majority of the time swimming (mainly when I had the helm), I came out grinning from ear to ear.
Can't wait to meet more of you and find out more of what cherub sailing is all about.
I will most definitely be at the inlands and looking for all the advice and knowhow I can get. Hopefully both my brother and sister will be down to crew so If anyone needs a (fairly novice) crew then I'm sure the one who isn't sailing with me would relish the chance to get out on the water for some practice.
Just to let people know, I will be based for the time being in Chichester harbour, but I am looking to find a club worth joining nearer to West London if anyone has any suggestions.
;D
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Ben,
We joined Queen Mary when we got our Cherub 3 years ago.
Pro's - for cherub sailing it is pretty much ideal. No mud, no sand, no chop, no tide/current, deep enough to capsize without digging your mast in the bottom and contrary to heavier boats launching and recovery is really easy in a cherub (easiest place we have sailed a cherub at). Plus the club is very positive about cherubs and tollerated our learning curve. Also there is plenty of space on the water and Sunday afternoons you have most of the water to yourself which is handy for twin wire blasting. You would also have another cherub (us) for company. I think we are the only regularly sailing cherub in the West London area. You also don't have to do duties (though you can if you wish - do 4 and you get £100 off membership)
Con's not the most picturesque of places and there are cheaper clubs (but further away or with much less water). Wind will be a bit shifty compared to the open parts of CH (but steadier than up by Itchenor) but you would find that in any inland venue
The only other local alternatives would be Datchet (noisy and even more concrete bowl than QMSC) or Island Barn (a bit on the small side for cherubing).
See how you find sailing a cherub at QMSC at the Inlands
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Hi Ben,
Welcome to the class. I live down in Clanfield so only about 15 mins from Chichester Harbour if you need any help at all, I've sailed Atum Bom a handful of times so it's not completely new to me. I am a member down at Netley SC, so although west of London... not West London, but we would be more than happy for you to come and join us down here at any time to do a bit of sea sailing.
Let us know how you get on, Atum is a great boat and you will not be disappointed! I moved from a Laser 2 to a Cherub a few years ago and my only real advice is hang on tight! :-D
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Hopefully both my brother and sister will be down to crew so If anyone needs a (fairly novice) crew then I'm sure the one who isn't sailing with me would relish the chance to get out on the water for some practice.
Ben, I think Andrew is borrowing Born Slippy for the event and looking for a crew. PM me and we can confirm things.
PS Congrats on the new boat. It was great meeting up with you at the end of the nationals, sorry we were to tired to take you sailing that day.
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Hi Ben,
Your not alone coming to Cherubs from a more sedate class. We've all done it at some point. I came from sailing an enterprise and had quite a steep learning curve. In fact I would say we learn more everytime we sail. You do have to scare yourself a little to get it right but the buzz of getting it right is worth all the swims and practice.
The cherub class is the most helpfull and freindly class I've come across. Look forward to meeting you.
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On the other hand, I hadn't sailed at all before cherubs. That meant I had no preconceptions about how a boat should sail, which was quite handy for my helm!
Needless to say, I love it, and the class is a great group of people. I hold Will and Lucy wholly responsible for our cherub addiction. If they hadn't fed us pizza this never would have happened.
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So went out for the first time this weekend. Wind was force 4-5 but steady, tide was about 5kn though which made things interesting. Due to a really long narrow slipway at Thorney Island, it is not really feasible to put the sails up before getting in the water. The idea was to get to the beach at Pilsey Island, and then put the sails up We initially tried to tow Atom behind my parents Wayfarer. Practically capsizing (without the sails) and the tide put paid to that idea so we went back in for a jib. Turns out you need both sails up in a cherub otherwise it has absolutely no steerage even though it went along pretty well. Once we got the sails on, chest deep in a 5kn tide next to a mud bank, we spent a lot of time flip flopping about going further and further away from where we wanted to be. I forgot to mention that this is in the middle of a 100 yd wide channel with boats moored every 50m in two lines. Anyway, after a minor collision with a Cornish Shrimper, we managed to achieve our first successful tack and made back a bit of the ground we had lost to the tide. Needless to say we went straight back in the drink again once we tried to tack again due to my eagerness to be facing in the other direction and not really waiting for my brother to unhook. Finally we managed to string some tacks together and Sam (my brother) got the hang of playing the main for balance and we were off. A few more tacks and we were out of the moored boats and away planing upwind ;D ;D ;D.
I LOVE THIS BOAT. I can't honestly believe that it took me this long to upgrade from my Laser 2. After trying to do a twin wire fly by to my parents on the beach (unfortunately with cameras in hand), we took a spectacular nosedive (I personally blame the t-foil, or my lack of knowledge as to what the hell I am supposed to do with it).
Next it was time to take my sister (Charlie) out for a spin. Now having successfully learned to tack on the way up to the beach, I was in a slightly better position to teach Charlie what to do. The wind was starting to die a bit so we weren't both able to get out on the wires but it gave me a chance to work out which direction I was supposed to be pointing in. We hadn't been in the water for a while so decided the fastest way to do this was to put the kite up. As we were doing this I remembered a veritable gem of information that Paul had told me when he took me for a test sail. "Always pull up your kite on land first to check you have it attached right. " Long story short, I had forgotten that the sheets have to go round the fore-stay and we went for a swim. Whilst over I thought it would be sensible to try to remedy this situation. After 2 more "intentional" capsizes, and a lot of tied up spinnaker the only option was to head for the beach before going back to Thorney. It was well worth it. With the ropes finally sorted we had a fantastic downwind blast for 5 mins all the way back to the sailing club.
I am definitely not sure I'm ready for racing yet and I need to bring Sam up to speed with the kite, but we will be there and having fun at the Inlands at the beginning of October.
When we were out on the water we realized that almost all of the bungee had seen better days so a quick trip down to the chandlers and it is bedecked in shiny new shock cord. Also a problem with the end of one of the racks being cracked but until we can get some carbon to fix it with, a section of tube from a snapped laser boom fit inside exactly so hopefully that should hold it for the time being.
One thing that became very evident was that our 13 year old harnesses were not really up to the task. Does anyone have any suggestions as to a good way to go, bearing in mind we don't really know which of the three of us will be sailing it? I was thinking of the Gill trapeze harness, it is not too bad on the price front and was a good fit when I tried it on.
Sorry for such a long post, I'm pretty exited ;D
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you've learnt a lot.
Pick your launch sites carefully. Sometimes it is easier to carry the boat in on it's side and right it.
You can't sail very easily with just a jib and you can't go up wind at all. We've tried this.
Always check the kite ashore even when you think you've got it right. ocasionally we all make mistakes.
It's rewarding to get a nice kite run on your first outing.
Our experience is practice makes perfect but initially you want to find a bit of water without to many boats on it and a rescue boat to hand.
Good luck
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I am glad you are smiling after what sounded like a bit of a battering, with some good bits!
If you can, take the bit of laser boom out of the rack. Carbon+alu+saltwater = electrofizzy badness.
See you at the inlands (if we get there)
Will
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I am in the process of working out which club to move to as the current one is really not suitable from either a launching or a rigging point of view. There are plenty around and the combo of summer at Netley and winter at QMSC sounds like it might be the best bet at the moment. I was thinking of trying out Netley this Saturday coming up as I won't have the support of my parents in their boat if things go badly.
I knew that stainless is bad next to carbon but it didn't even twig that aluminium was the same. I'll get on the carbon fix right away then. It will hold up without the aluminium bit but considering the spinnaker sheet pulls from there I am anxious to get it strong again. I am a complete novice but my initial idea was to make a tube of carbon/epoxy and while wet, put it in the inside of the rack and then inflate a bike tyre inside it with some parcel tape wrapped around. Any thoughts? Also how is the aluminium/carbon combo in fresh water?
I have no idea how you deal with more than 1 day of cherub sailing in a row. I was absolutely broken after that. Still pretty sore today if truth be told, but as you say. . . smiling.
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Thanks for making us smile!
We hope to see you soon
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Sounds like you are having fun already, keep the sailing and the stories coming.
Aluminium tube inside a carbon one is a bad idea, there are loads of broken RS600 and RS800 masts about because they had an ali tube inside which corroded and expanded. Fresh water will not make any difference to the outcome, just make it a little slower.
For the repair I think your plan will be a bit difficult to get right, I have never had much luck with using a bladder.
I would make up a short section of tubing. you want it to have a slightly larger OD than the wing bar's ID. If the laser boom is a tight fit in the current tube, then it would probably an ideal mandrel cover it in melted candle wax so you can get it off.
Once you have the repair tube cut it length ways, and then depending on the size difference either cut a strip out, or sand the slot larger. You want a C section that will close to an O when you push it inside the tube you are repairing.
Once you have everything ready dry fit a few times, then coat the outside of the repair tube in resin and push it in. Job done
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Cheers Phil, I'll give that a go
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I did warn you that Cherub sailing is highly addictive and once experienced there is no going back, Glad you are enjoying it so much! Regarding the wing bar, I hadn't noticed any significant damage but I do have a large selection of carbon tube off cuts that may be suitable for an internal sleeve, let me know the internal diameter and I will have a look.
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Pretty sure it's 2" but I don't have it to hand, either that or 50mm. I'll get it measured and get back to you.
Thanks
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I would reccomend Phil A's repair. it's probably worth sanding the inside of the rack a little to provide a good key to the sleave. You don't need a thick sleave either because you are reinforcing the existing tube. In fact a thick sleave may add a stress concentration where it ends. if the rack tube is splintered near the end I would also be worth wrapping a couple of carbon strands covered in resin around the outside. These will knit everything together nicely.
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Hi Guys
Ben's brother here, following him in to the excitments and dangers fo Cherub sailing!
I will be at the Inlands so will hopfully get to meet some of you there and get some much needed tips.
I keep looking forward to the weekends when I can sail it agian!
Sam
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Hi Sam
Good to hear you are still keen despite the bruises. Look forward to meeting you at the inlands.
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Harnesses: We now have P+B nappy harnesses, and Beth has one of these as well. Hers needs to be let out from time to time cos she is 14 and still growing. Do Zhik still do the one which is adjustable with big areas of velcro? The type covered in buckles I would not recommend because they get caught on everything and cause capsizes and reduced funnage.
Can you send a pic of the crack in the wingbar please?
Sorry for being disorganised everyone (can only get to forum in short bursts when baby is asleep and I am awake): Is there a late season blast planned?
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Hi Ben
Can you copy me in with the photo, cheers
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The Gill harnesses are the nappy type with a bit of adjustment. All of the buckles are covered though so it should be fine.
I'll see if Sam can take a photo of the rack and post it.
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I have a Gill and am happy with it as it is very comfy and has adjusted from me at 95kg down to 80kg. It also fits with the dry suit and 20 layers of thermals on.
I do wear a knackered shorty over everything, which avoids catching issues Will talked about. However, this is more to allow me to pee without taking my suit off - my under suits have slits in which would make them indecent without it.
Please no replies about the other relief option.
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Nice :)
How do I go about joining the class association? when I click on the online payment bit it takes me to paying for the 2006-7 season. Has this been updated somewhere or do I just go with it?
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Sorry I dunno - I don't think the fees have gone up since then, but hang on until someone gives you the true news.
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Ben,
adult membership is £30. Student membership is £20.
Phil or Carol Alderson will be able to tell you if the Pay Pal account is upto date. I believe it has been routed to the classes new bank account and that payments are being recieved. Alternatively send a Cheque to Carol. If joining in September onwards it covers you for next year.
PM. Carol for her address.
Once your payment has been recieved you will be able to view the members area of the forum.
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Nice :)
How do I go about joining the class association? when I click on the online payment bit it takes me to paying for the 2006-7 season. Has this been updated somewhere or do I just go with it?
That is strange, when I use the "Buy now" links on the Joining (http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/shop) page it takes me to 2010-2011 paypal page.
Where is the link you have been clicking on?
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Ah I see, I have been going to it through the For Sale pages.
http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/join_the_class_associationThe "buy on-line" link here takes you to a 2006-7 page.
sorry I'm a test engineer, it's my job to find out where things are broken :)
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Payment should have gone through :)
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Ah I see, I have been going to it through the For Sale pages.
http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/join_the_class_associationThe "buy on-line" link here takes you to a 2006-7 page.
sorry I'm a test engineer, it's my job to find out where things are broken :)
Good Spot, I did not know that page existed, it is now gone, and the link updated to point to the correct page.
Phil
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Test Engineer + Cherub Class = An overworked test engineer.
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I finally managed to get a couple of pictures of the cracked pipe.
They are attached. Sorry they aren't too clear, I didn't want to peel back the foam grip.
I wrapped up the alu boom piece in parcel tape for time being as for galvanic corrosion you need direct electrical contact.
Good sail today, just myself and Sam. Had a bit of trouble going downwind and getting the spinnaker up was a bit tricky. Done some research and it seems we were doing it a bit wrong. I needed to be pointing further downwind to hoist. Needless to say, we lost count of the amount of times we capsized but on the plus side, upwind sailing is a lot better. Next time I get to sail will be the Inlands so unfortunately no time to do any more practice.
My brand new harness broke on the first outing so more than a little disappointed. Seems as if the cheap plastic that gill make their ladderlocks from is not up to holding my weight. Is being too heavy covered under warranty?
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and the next one
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If the harness fits you it should be designed to accomodate your weight. I would send it back and tell the supplier your problem.
Hoisting , you should be able to bear away onto a broad reach for the first 2/3rds of the hoist but need to bear down deeper for the final couple of pulls as the sail will fill. Then head up as the crew sheets the sail in and starts to come out. This bit needs co-ordinating as well. Glad you are getting better.
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Nice :)
How do I go about joining the class association? when I click on the online payment bit it takes me to paying for the 2006-7 season. Has this been updated somewhere or do I just go with it?
That is strange, when I use the "Buy now" links on the Joining (http://www.uk-cherub.org/doku.php/shop) page it takes me to 2010-2011 paypal page.
Anyone happen to know what happens next after paying using the Buy Now links? Not heard anything since payment was processed.
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Sorry not looked at the emails, your profile has been changed now.
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I wrapped up the alu boom piece in parcel tape for time being as for galvanic corrosion you need direct electrical contact.
I've heard that said before and seen it done before, but the state of the broken spar I looked at suggested that a liberal supply of seawater provides enough conductivity for bad things to happen...